Holy Cows: George W Bush - buffoon or great leader?

[quidnunc]

The ONLY lie — and a stinking, bald-faced lie it is, too — is that the Bush administration lied to the American people.

like i said, it isn't lieing when they actually believed what they were saying. but i don't expect you to read this and comprehend it.

and if you go back and watch the preinvasion footage, they were clear in that they were going into Iraq to "Account" for weapons of mass destruction. they didn't find any, so they accounted for them. spin that...

There were over 20 justifications listed in the resolution which Congress approved, of which the WMD issue was only one.

It has since been established that while Iraq didn't have stocks of WMD, it did have the programs in place to manufacture them on short notice.

By the way, did you see that just recently we shipped 600 short tons of Saddam's uranium yellowcake to Canada?

Now why do you suppose Saddam thought he needed 600 tons of the seed material for high-grade nuclear enrichment?

[quidnunc]

The country is virtually bankrupt: the country has had to borrow trillions of dollars. Immigration is a mess. Iraq was not handled well. 5 years on now, they seem to be getting the handle on it, but that's billions of dollars too late.
Bush's appointments to key positions were terrible, he appointed people that were loyal to him rather than appointing people who were capable.
On the culture wars, besides appointing a couple of decent supreme court judges, he hasn't done much.
I like the way he handled Europe and the U.N., but his administration has not done well on Latin America and the Carribean. The U.S., Canada and France invaded and overthrew a democratically elected government in Haiti in order to replace it with a peice of crap. They've allowed Chavez to destroy Venezuela's oil infrastructure, thereby shortening oil supply, and Mexico has gone down the tubes, which now exports street gangs.
The new president will have a mess on his hands, and huge national debt.

I'd say Bush was alot like Mike Harris in Ontario. Some of the ideas were very good, but in many cases, the implementation of those ideas was very poorly done.

BullCENSORED!

[sturmgeshutz]

My point is that people were lied to in order to get their approval.

well a majority of americans didn't think they were lied to bad enough or they would of overthrown the government. and is it really lieing if they didn't know it was lieing?

The ONLY lie — and a stinking, bald-faced lie it is, too — is that the Bush administration lied to the American people.

oops, i misread your post, my apologeeeez.

[Red Green]

The country is virtually bankrupt: the country has had to borrow trillions of dollars. Immigration is a mess. Iraq was not handled well. 5 years on now, they seem to be getting the handle on it, but that's billions of dollars too late.
Bush's appointments to key positions were terrible, he appointed people that were loyal to him rather than appointing people who were capable.
On the culture wars, besides appointing a couple of decent supreme court judges, he hasn't done much.
I like the way he handled Europe and the U.N., but his administration has not done well on Latin America and the Carribean. The U.S., Canada and France invaded and overthrew a democratically elected government in Haiti in order to replace it with a peice of crap. They've allowed Chavez to destroy Venezuela's oil infrastructure, thereby shortening oil supply, and Mexico has gone down the tubes, which now exports street gangs.
The new president will have a mess on his hands, and huge national debt.

I'd say Bush was alot like Mike Harris in Ontario. Some of the ideas were very good, but in many cases, the implementation of those ideas was very poorly done.

BullCENSORED!

I agree with quidnunc on this. Bush is no Mike Harris. Harris was actually a bright guy and I think he actually did some good things in Ontario, although that was after I had left so.....

[TomSowell2]

regarding the Iraq decision and Bush's subsequent one-upmanship with the surge, there was a very interesting article at RealClearPolitics.com the other day written by Michael Barone, a good commentator:
http://www.realclearpolitics.com/articl ... aving.html

he noted that Harry Truman was completely isolated in June 1948 by his decision to hold on to Berlin when the airlift was started:
top-level military men with long war experience like Secretary of State Marshall and Joint Chiefs commander Omar Bradley said: give up Berlin, we cannot defend it against the Soviets

give up Berlin!? can you imagine ??

but that is the advice that the stubborn and isolated Truman was given; he ignored it

Q.: would a stable, prosperous Iraq make Bush look similarly stubborn but correct?

.

[virgey]

My point is that people were lied to in order to get their approval.

well a majority of americans didn't think they were lied to bad enough or they would of overthrown the government. and is it really lieing if they didn't know it was lieing?

Yes it is lying whether the people knew it or not. That is like saying it is NOT murder if no one knew a murder took place. Are you for real, or maybe you are trying to be funny. Also your claim that the people would have overthrown the government if they had been lied enough to, is also ludicrous.

[virgey]

The ONLY lie — and a stinking, bald-faced lie it is, too — is that the Bush administration lied to the American people.

like i said, it isn't lieing when they actually believed what they were saying. but i don't expect you to read this and comprehend it.

and if you go back and watch the preinvasion footage, they were clear in that they were going into Iraq to "Account" for weapons of mass destruction. they didn't find any, so they accounted for them. spin that...

The point is they DID know they were lying.

[sturmgeshutz]

My point is that people were lied to in order to get their approval.

well a majority of americans didn't think they were lied to bad enough or they would of overthrown the government. and is it really lieing if they didn't know it was lieing?

Yes it is lying whether the people knew it or not. That is like saying it is NOT murder if no one knew a murder took place.

NO you didn't understand my post. IF the government didn't know there were no WMDS, and thought there was, then it wasn't lieing. Cripes they stillaren't sure if there wasn't any. all the evidence points to syria now anyways, thats from Hans blix's mouth.

lastly, one of the reasons they went into Iraq was to "ACCOUNT" for Wmds. let me say that again, tehy went into iraq to "ACCOUNT" for wmds. so where is the lie? let me say that again. where is the lie?

[sturmgeshutz]

The point is they DID know they were lying.

Prove it.

i surmise the Bush administration actually had MORE integrity than most previous governments, if it was Clinton or Carter, they would of just planted WMDS on iraqi soil.